On Monday night there was a ‘Public Meeting/Information Session’ to review Outdoor Wood Burning in Orangeville. There was a decent turnout for the session, i would say around 60 or more residents attended. The ‘Open Air Burning Committee’ has put together a draft of a by-law recommendation that they will forward to Council for approval in the upcoming month or so. If you have any comments, suggestions, changes or recommendations that you would like to see addressed before it goes to Council, please email jwilson@orangeville.ca, sbradley@orangeville.ca or sgreatrix@orangeville.ca (I would recommend getting these comments in by the end of May before the committee meets again at the beginning of June).
Here are the proposed changes to the by-law in a nutshell (minus all of the legal mumbo-jumbo)
- No Multi-Unit Dwelling or Townhouses will be permitted to burn wood
- In order to qualify for a permit, the fire must be at least:
- 75 m (250 ft) from a sensitive receptor (I will define that later)
- 7.5m (25 ft) from the property line
- 5.0m (16 ft) from a forest area
- 3.0m (10 ft) from a dwelling & attached structures i.e. decks
- 2.0m (6.5 ft) from any flammable material
- a safe distance, as determined by the Fire Official, from the following: structures, shed, canopy, hedge, fence, roadway, overhead wire, or obstruction
- A change to the Burn Permit fee from $20/yr to $40/yr
- The hours allowing burning would change from 9am-midnight to 3pm-11pm
- Also, they have proposed an “Incentive Program” where anyone who converts from wood to propane or gas burning could receive a $50 incentive from the Town of Orangeville for doing so.
Sensitive Receptor Definition (as written in the proposed by-law):
“Sensitive Receptor” shall include a childcare facility, healthcare facility, senior citizen’s residence, long-term care facility, educational facility, municipally owned property or other place where smoke may be a greater risk to the health of a group or individual, or to the environment.
There are currently 60 addresses listed on the ‘Standing Sensitive Receptors’ List which include every Childcare Facility, Church, County building, Town facility (which includes all Town Parks & Trails, School, Senior’s Residence, and the Hospital. Anyone who wishes to register to be listed as a Sensitive Receptor, will be able to do so by simply filling out a registry application annually at Town Hall if this proposed by-law passes.
The Reality of This Proposed By-Law
So here is the math of it all – By mandating that the fire be 25 feet away from your property line (in every direction) and a minimum of 10 feet from your house, AND 250 feet away from a “Sensitive Receptor” (this refers to the full radius surrounding these locations) , essentially they are preventing somewhere in the neighbourhood of 80% (or more) of homes in Orangeville from qualifying for a fire permit without actually “BANNING” outdoor wood burning…
My Humble Opinions…
According to the new Fire Chief, Ron Morden, there were approximately 400 fire permits issued in 2015. So, just for fun, let’s assume that every permit holder had 3 fires throughout the year – I’d say that’s probably a fair number – So, let’s say there were 1200 fires (by permit holders…and probably another 1000 or more by people without permits…)
Here’s where the fun comes…..out of all of these fires that were enjoyed by families all over Orangeville, there were 12 complaints. Yup…12.
So, can someone please explain to me why this is even an issue right now?? Throughout budget talks in The Town of Orangeville, I personally received hundreds of comments on my blog, personal messages and emails from residents with complaints or concerns about our ever-growing taxes…and yet, we saw another increase…but 12 people complain in one year about backyard fires and we form a committee to look at the by-law?!?!? Where are our priorities?!
All of the fire permits I have gotten over the years have come with the understanding that your permit can be revoked at anytime if you get excessive complaints from neighbours or if you burn prohibited items. This fact alone leads me to believe that the issues aren’t with permit holders because according to the Fire Chief, the number of permits that were revoked last year is Zero….
I am definitely sympathetic to those who have medical conditions that are worsened by wood smoke and if you are one of those people who have a neighbour who is disrespectful to that despite your attempts to have a rational, adult, neighborly conversation with them, my suggestion would be to discuss the revocation of their permit with the Fire Chief…and if they are burning without a permit, the Fire Chief should be looking at giving a fine. I would hope that the majority of people could be amicable enough to come up with some sort of compromise, but if that really isn’t your case, I believe that your complaint should have merit when speaking with the fire authorities.
My biggest concern with this proposal is that it would really alienate the masses unnecessarily.
Your Humble Opinions
Please share your opinions on this hot topic with me…whether you are for or against it, I would love to know why! Were you at the meeting? What did you think? And please, please, please use the email addresses I have listed at the start of this post to make sure your opinion is heard by the committee before this goes to council.
You are so astute, I am so sorry that you were not elected to council. You are able to rationalize every situation with calm passion and eloquently share with your readers.
Your assessment on last nights meeting and it’s ramifications to the community are “spot on”.
One thing you missed mentioning about the “rebate” it will be paid first, to permit holders and only up to a total of $5,000.00 so that amounts to only 100 people receiving that rebate, whereby 400 last year applied for a permit. And $50.00 on the purchase of a decent gas/propane fire pit, not a chintzy table top version that was being suggested, that will cost in excess of $500.00 without taking into account the cost of installing a gas line means nothing. At $800 to run a gas line as one attendee stated was her cost last night, it will inhibit a majority of people from adopting this option.
Also curious as to how many potential accidents there might be from people using propane and having the tank too close to the fire……
I think this whole committee concept was farcical and implemented to make it appear as though work was being done, I think the writing was on the wall the moment the Mayor spoke up in favour of banning firepits, but that’s just my “humble opinion”.
This is absolutely ridiculous. What needs to be done is not ban fires because of people’s improper use of a fire pit. If somebody wants to have a fire they should be a allowed. If you want to burn a a lot of leaves or burn garbage then you should be fined. Having a fire is for wood and no your daily trash. Abide by the previous bylaws but increase the fines on anybody that can’t learn to obey these bylaws. It shouldn’t be at these people who are burning garbage or a tonne of leaves expenses that we lose our privledge to have a proper fire. If your neighbours are being to loud call the cops if they can’t listen to reason. Or if you just don’t want to deal with the backlash. Most people complaining probably have a neighbour who isn’t complying with bylaw because they are inhaling a tonne of smoke because of the improper use. People use your pits or whatever you have to burn in properly and then bylaws wouldn’t have to be changed. And people wouldn’t need to complain. The bylaws don’t need changed just the people who can’t abide by them. The time frame for fires seems reasonable but the distance of 250ft is a lil extreme when kids aren’t in school in the summer regardless.
12 complaints requires a committee to overhaul the entire bylaw and prevent people who have abided by the proper process and obtained burn permits to actually have backyard fires?
The ludicrousness of this just amazes me. The people who the complaints are made about are 99% of the time people who do not obtain burn permits. So the likelyhood of them suddenly obtaining burn permits, particularly in a bylaw designed to ban burning without actually having the balls to ban it, is still slim to none.
Interesting, how a large number of residents have been calling for the closure or repurposing of the Tony Rose pools for years, and not only does Council ignore that, but then proposes dumping MORE money into it. But 12 complaints for 1200 fires, and suddenly we need an overhaul and it’s a ‘serious issue’?
It’s embarrassing enough knowing there are colleagues and friends in Toronto who use our council meetings and the Q&A pages as their daily/weekly doses of entertainment. Perhaps at the end of this four years we will learn that these are all actors and this was one big joke?
i think its crazy the new by law rules 250 ft to a sensitive receptor ok hospitals retirement homes yes i agree but school churches and parks and preschools peek a boo is empty by 5 and never used on wknds
the park in my area rarely gets used due to it being torn up for well over a year now and not a soul is ever seen working there and even when it does get use its very minimal no one goes there after dark and most just use it as a pass through and as for the new boundries within the property they are all over the map 6 ft for this 10 ft for that 25 ft for another how about a 10 ft all around perimeter i think its fair and for most of the complainers i find if you just talk to them and maybe invite them over for a fire they tend be at ease with the situation and heck maybe even get a great neighbor out of the deal god knows i did never mind taking away from the family added value of a fire teach your kids the value added safety of fires how to make one and just all around sheer fun for famlies of all ages so please town council dont reprimand the good citizen of orangeville for a few unlawfull actions
Well said Lisa
I used the above email addresses and sent them the following;
Good morning
Your proposal is ludicrous. You are trying to change the laws based on the complaints of 12 people. Yet the town complains about high taxes and nothing is done. Yet 12 people can get council off there Butts to look at something so insanely ludicrous it infringes on how we as citizens enjoy our life. I don’t like the smell of manure being used on lawns for fertilizer should that be banned? My wife is a vegetarian should the bbqing of meat be banned because of the smell? Those two proposals are as asinine as the one you are trying to change.
Stop messing with law abiding citizens lives and do something for this city that actually makes a difference.
Stay out of my backyard.
Sincerely
Cameron
Thank you for positing your blog
So in other words if you have a very big back yard then you can apply. My yard is pretty big and it won’t qualify. Even though there is a great spot that wouldn’t be a danger or effect any neighbours (unless on a windy day). Let’s make more laws to keep people indoors! Jeeez
Well, I’m now in Mono with property and feel it is appropriate to have a fire pit when it is a great distance away from everyone. When I was in town we had 2 different neighbours who would burn a fire on their little 35 x 100 ft lot. Both neighbours would drink around the fire (and really that is a joy we currently do around ours)….. but when people drink they become jerks. They were loud and their fires went well late – keeping me up and ruining my plans of a morning run because of the lack of sleep. Did we talk to them? No way. I didn’t know these people, but if they were so inconsiderate with the fire pit, I could totally see them retaliating by having more fires and being more loud. Yes, it was maybe 3 or 4 times during the summer, but in a condensed neighbourhood, it is my opinion that fire pits should be banned. If your property in town is big enough to accommodate the distances of the proposed by-law, then chances are, you aren’t bothering your neighbours. I know how the O’ville Q & A page is and I wouldn’t even voice my opinion there because all of them would jump down my throat. But I believe the distances in the by-law are fair.
For you to put “when people drink they become jerks” is a very broad and unrealistic statement to make! If your neighbors, while living in town, had to call 911 for an emergency and crews were there “well late” would you still not go for your morning run because they ruined your nights sleep?! I’d almost be willing to bet that you would be at the window watching as a nosey neighbor to see what the ruckus was. Furthermore not going and talking to them about your ability not to sleep is your own fault. Living in a condensed community was your choice and if you so choose to keep to yourself that is your decision. I think as an adult it is our responsibility to voice our opinion when something bothers us, as a parent this is what I teach my three young children. Somethings on your mind say it, no harm in voicing your opinion but be prepared for someone else’s opinion that you may not appreciate.
We are truly over legislated but the Council and 1/2 of it members do provide great Comedy Show and they likely enjoy the game they THINK they are receiving.
What I cannot stand is somebody else telling me what I can do in my own yard (Being considerate of neighbors of course). My neighbors don’t have A/C, so when their windows are open, I don,t have a fire. I keep the hose at ready at all times and fully soak the fire afterwards. I get the whole buying a permit thing, but I guess Ill burn and just have food nearby to say that I’m “cooking”
I feel there is no need for anyone to have open fires in an urban area. If you want to sit by a fire than I suggest you take your family camping someplace where the smoke will not bother your neighbors.
We live too close together in town to have smoke blowing around into peoples windows.
I live in an area of fairly good size lots by town standards and I have a neighbor who , during the good weather burns a fire at least 4 times a week. The biggest problem is he burns GARBAGE. Burning garbage has a very distinct smell and this rancid smoke fills my bedroom on these nights.
I have never complained , I have never even went out to find out which of the many houses down wind from me is the culprit. The point is why should I have to ? Should not common sense and courtesy dictate that burning in an area where the smoke would blow into someones home is a bad idea. These qualities are sorely lacking. That is why we need too many laws to tell us what to do.
Burning garbage is already not allowed under the current bylaw. You should have complained, as that is illegal.
The law already states that. This new bylaw is worse.
And there are many families who can’t afford camping or going somewhere fires are allowed, whether because of cost, or because of working jobs where they cannot take the time off.
If not broken..don’t fix it
I could see if quarter or even a thirty second of orangeville s population was complaining. But 12??
12 complaints created a committee. Oh Lisa you should have been elected. Or maybe you are lucky you weren’t.
This all started over the tenant by the Bluebird Café complaining about the wood fired pizza oven at the Bluebird. From this incident, we now go to very well banning all wood fires. I was at that council meeting, and listened as they said they were striking a committee to look into this.
Common sense people if u want to have a fire invite ur neighbors over if there is a person that has a repertory problem let them know u are having a fire and u wanted to give them a heads up lets face it if 12 complaints over the whole summer were issued then how many were investigated and what was the out come. The only reason why I ask is I’m pretty sure (like was said by someone else) the whole town is complaining about the property taxes being so high is this what our tax dollars are being wasted on let’s look at some other issues I’m sure over the last 12 months there has been more then 12 complaints about the police is that the next thing to be banned in orangeville or how about any restaurant in town that’s has 12 complaints or the simple fact that there are numerous complaints everyweek about people speeding down the street running stop signs and a whole slew of other problems in town what’s next ban the town. I say it’s time this town woke up and fight back we elect these people to run our town with the best interests of the whole town not drive away all businesses and tell us what we can or can’t do in our own back yard. I for one have had enough of this crap I’m not moving orangeville is my home and I will be having a fire in my back yard respondsable manner everyone is welcome in my backyard all summer long
Personally, I think this has all come about because Jeremy Williams does not like outdoor fire pits himself. There are much more important things that should be looked at in this town.
We obtained a permit and then we were called a few days later to say we have to tear it up as there was a sensitive in our area. Meanwhile our neighbour’s lit up their firepit tonight ..obviously without a permit and a foot away from a wooden fence…what are we supposed to think when it’s only the honest people following the rules?..